Will Concealed Weapons or Media Reform Make College Campuses Safer?
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Yesterday our nation experienced yet another tragic school shooting. We can now add Northern Illinois University to the roster with Virginia Tech, Shepherd University, University of Arizona, Appalachian School of Law, University of Arkansas, San Diego State, University of Iowa, and the University of Texas. How can America or Idaho protect ourselves against future school shootings?
Several ideas get thrown around after these tragedies happen, usually the same ideas each time. Gun controls get discussed, with some folks advocating stricter controls and others saying we need looser controls like concealed weapons permits. Then some people say it is not guns but rather the media to blame. First we blame the news media for sensationalizing and glamorizing the shooters. Then the blame shifts to content producers for violent video games and movies. Those content producers defend themselves by pointing to violence in literature, art, history, and the Bible. Then the blame gets shifted back around to parenting shortfalls, and from there the debates taper off into minutia as we realize there is no single perfect solution to the violence. I should say the debates taper off until the next violent tragedy occurs.
The Idaho Statesman reports that our legislature is considering a bill to allow concealed weapons on college campuses. Permit holders would just have to notify school administrators that they may do carry concealed weapons onto campus. Apparently a 10,000+ member group called the Students for Concealed Carry on Campus is pushing several states to ease concealed weapons laws on campuses. You have to wonder who is funding this “student group” and their true motives when the bill being considered includes “a provision that would strip cities and counties of authority to regulate shooting galleries and ranges”. Wait a minute, how does that make our campuses safer? It sounds like another sneaky gun lobby tactic to me.
Would allowing concealed weapons on college campuses make shootings less likely? It’s questionable how some students could dress themselves in the morning, let alone get into college, and you have to factor in how much accidental shootings would increase if we allowed concealed weapons.
When Moscow, Idaho experienced a tragic public shooting last summer, one guy thought he would play the hero and tried returning fire to the gunman. The unfortunate good Samaritan only got himself shot and created more problems in the chaos. You have to wonder how police feel about this issue, since they would be the ones rushing into a potential war zone of students firing guns at each other. How is the cop supposed to know who is the original gunman? I can just see innocent people who try to shoot the shooter, then get mistakenly killed by cops. While the cops shoot the wrong gunmen, the real gunman could fire more shots.
On the other hand, I read that most of the time cops arrive after the shooting has ended. Maybe if people knew concealed weapons are allowed on campus more potential shooters would reconsider their rampage?
What about our other usual suspects? Our media does tend to glamorize the shooters, to the point of undoubtedly inspiring other potential shooters. I looked at some news sites today and was surprised to see conservative Fox News glamorizing this tragedy the worst of all. They had the biggest picture of the shooter and the biggest front-page real estate devoted to the shooting. However, is it the media’s fault or ours because we click on their links and read their glamorized stories?
Should news media develop an industry ethic, a guideline in how they report these tragedies? Should they omit the gunman’s name, picture, history, etc.? One of MSNBC’s reported top 10 school shooting myths is that school violence is rampant. They report that school violence is actually dropping, yet we have the perception that it is increasing. Why?
What do you think?
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Comments
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0 
0 And another thing…
There’s absolutely no difference between the media reporting this story or a blog discussion. Somebody logs on and Googles college shooting or any number of key words, and your blog is going to come up right next to Fox’s story or Brian Adams with the nightly news. There’s the same story being told except one is coming from Tom Brokaw and the other from Mike or JoseCuervo!
Until we stop giving these punks a platform to “go out on”, these shootings will never stop!
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0 0 I don’t see anything wrong with discussing the situation. Ignoring it doesn’t make it go away. I’m not so sure that media attention is the reason that many of these sick individuals do what they do.
I am firmly against any legislation that will make it easier for private citizens to bear arms in public places, whether they are concealed or not. This isn’t the Wild West.
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0 0 you said
“I’m against concealed weapons on the campus. That isn’t the answer. It will only make the guns easier for these punks to get. What happens if someone snaps during class? Has an argument over a girlfriend or what have you? If we let students carry guns on campus it’s going to be the wild wild west all over again and thats not then environment I want my kids living in.
”
I would have to strongly disagree with that. First of all if someone wanted to kill someone over a Gf a restriction in concealed weapons will only give him the right to bare arms. I do not think a shooter gives a crap about school policy.
I think its a great idea to allow people with concealed weapons to pack guns in school. Someone with a concealed weapons permit already is packing a gun all over our city. Whats the difference if they are packing the gun on campus?
I also think students with guns is a good idea. Because a shooter will usualy strike so fast and kill so many people by the time the ungunned campus panzi force gets to the scene to investigate its already to late.
The police sure as hell arent going to get there to save anyone. By the time police are called and get there everyone is injured or dead.
I am a student at ISU and I would feel much safer knowing that several classmates could be packing a gun and shoot back if an attack happend. By the time a shooter shot a few students a person carrying a concealed weapon could neutralize the entire situation and save several other lives.(inluding idiots oppossed to weapons on campus)
I like the idea of concealed weapons in school beter than no guns allowed for the good people and the bad guys can break all the rules so easy and just kill us all any time they want, even at a slow pace if they desire.
I also understand there are some un educated folk out there that doesnt see the same connection I might with this whole thing and still think we should all stick to the same procedures. We need to wake up and smell the coffee the current procedures do not work. Do you think a shooter cares about some stupid sign that says no weapons allowed? Hell no they don’t. only his future victims follow all the rules and come to class unarmed waiting for a shooting to happen some day. Its not a question if a shooting will ever happen. The question is when will it happen and where will it happen?
My question is to ISU Staff: How can you protect my safety and my kids safety and student safety with an unarmed public safety force and no students packing a gun on campus?
Utah State currently allows students to pack guns on campus. I heard it has a perfect track record.
I think we live in violent times and we are making a big mistake by allowing anyone to tell us we can’t defend our own lives.
The funny part about this is all the people who get killed in these situations are usualy people against people having guns at all. People will have guns no matter what. I would really like to be at the same level as them if they attack and be able to respond in the same manner they do to prevent my own death.
CONCEALED GUNS ON CAMPUS !!!!!!! I SUPPORT THIS!!!
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0 0 I’m for concealed weapons by FACULTY on campuses but not students. College age people aren’t exactly known for their great impulse control and really shouldn’t even think about carrying weapons on campus. And like Joe said, how would the cops know who the shooter is and who the students are? They wouldn’t. Even with the faculty carrying it might present problems. Lots of students carrying guns would only result in even more innocent lives being lost.
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0 0 live free said:
The funny part about this is all the people who get killed in these situations are usualy people against people having guns at all.
Did you make that up? How do you know that? I disagreed with many of your arguments but that statement took the cake. Did someone interview the victims after they were killed to learn their position on gun rights?
I’ll tell you one thing you can believe. The more guns there are around, the better chance a bad person will get one.
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0 0 thats not true. When you take guns away the only people who have them are the bad people. The reason anti guns people are usualy shooting victims is because they believe they can defend them selves against a gun attack with out a gun and think they are so smart. Well people need to stop worrying about guns falling in the wrong hands and worry about them being in the right hands. Disagree with me all you want. It wont change my view of it nothing will there is only one way to secure schools from shootings let the college kids with concealed weapons permits pack guns. So kids thier age are fine to send to war to kill for our country but not smart enought to carry guns at school huh? Get out of here. I am 34 and have a permit no record and so many other students are fine to pack a gun. You conservatives will be the end of us all. While you are at it take away our army too. We can fight the world with out troops bullets are imaginary right? wake up man people are getting slaughtered by gun crazy maniacs that dont look crazy. i am more afraid of people like you taking my rights away. your like a sheep go muhhhh muhhhhh lol easy target i might ad too. Why be easy targets its time to defend our selves. I hope law makers don’t listen to idiots who arent even going to school. We did a student poll at ISU that was random and 75% of students support concealed weapons on campus.
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0 0 Ha ha ha ha ha it looks like its going to pass in Idaho too. Take that conservatives here it is http://www3.state.id.us/oasis/S1381.html
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0 0 Live Free said:
“You conservatives will be the end of us all. While you are at it take away our army too. We can fight the world with out troops bullets are imaginary right? wake up man people are getting slaughtered by gun crazy maniacs that dont look crazy. i am more afraid of people like you taking my rights away.”
I’m not sure what your major is but it’s obviously not political science. There isn’t a conservative in the country trying to take your precious right to bear arms away from you. Conservatives WANT you to pack a gun!
You are talking about liberals. Those are those evil underworld folks controlling the media and trying to champion gun control laws. AND since this latest rash of killings is being blamed on the media glorifying the shooters, it must be the liberals who are responsible for all these shootings since it is they who control all we see and hear. Its all part of the Democratic Party’s plan do reduce the population of college students so the United States will have to hire more foreign nationals to fill our skilled positions.
Think this sounds like the maniacal ranting of an idiot?? It doesn’t even compare to what “live free” wrote. I would suggest he ask for his tuition to be refunded because he is obviously wasting his money.
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0 0 yea its not Political science thats for sure. I get confused about politics. But one thing that doesnt confuse me is the fact students are sitting ducks when gun control laws prevent us from packing guns. Only the wierdo’s are packing guns. That really scares me. I just wish someone would listen to us students and not the outsiders who arent on campus. We want to use our concealed weapons permit to pack guns on campus. I would feel safer and I know several others would feel safer and also they would be safer.
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0 0 ISU/UI Alumni I am not an idiot I just want people to realize we need to protect our selves. I wish the school would just allow us to pack guns like Utah’s colleges. I just get real mad with people who think you can fight back against these attacks by providing victims couseling or not showing it on the news. Our public safety would crap in thier pants if someone attacked our school becuase they don’t have any way of stopping an attacker. I am sorry if you think I am an idiot for thinking thats a bit scary.
What do we do in the event someone litteraly attacks us? throw a pen at him or her? hide? run? scream? cry? That is like the only options we have right now. I think we need to organize an event on campus I am going to work on it. We need students who support 1381 to show up and let everyone know they support it. ISU/UI Alumni what would you recommend being a knower of politics? Should we march up and down the streets and have other students state wide attend? 5,000 people or 10,000? What do you think it would take to pass a bill like that?
I just want to see the right thing happen for our safety. I am glad to see someone here that might be able to give some good advice on this. I am not good with the political crap i never had the interest until i see something that needs to change.
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0 0 I just wish someone on here would for once live outside the ignorance box and really consider the good views I have mentioned.
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0 0 I have been an ISU student for 6 years (professional degree), and have prior LE experience. When the VT shootings happened I had several faculty and fellow students ask if I was carrying or could carry concealed on campus. They all thought it would be a good idea, especially if someone had firearms experience like I do. IMO there is nothing wrong with carrying concealed on campus as long as the school has a criteria set up for making sure those who do carry are mature enough and experienced enough to do so. The problem will arise when some nut goes ballistic again, and this time it happens on a campus that allows weapons. Everyone will blame the weapons allowed policy, and we will begin debating banning weapons on campus. Then they will be banned. Then someone will go ballistic and shoot up another campus. Then we will debate allowing weapons on campus. And so on, and so on, and so on……..
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0 0 Blow by blow of why CR67 is wrong:
1. “Making guns easier to get by these punks” - The punk is the problem not the guns.
2. “If someone snaps during class” - The snapper is the problem not the guns.
3. “Wild Wild West environment” - The shooters that start the altercation in the Wild Wild West are the problem, not the guns.
4. “Stop sensationalizing these people” - The people are the problem not the sensationalizing.
5. “Metal detectors in classrooms” - The lack of detectors is not the problem. The shooters are the problem.
6. “Concealed weapons” - Concealed weapons won’t solve the problem. It’s a form of protection from the problem.
7. “Giving punks a platform” - The platform is not the problem. The punk is the problem.
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0 0 Thanks for posting that bill, I was not able to tell if it had that extra “provision that would strip cities and counties of authority to regulate shooting galleries and ranges”, was that in there? How much are shooting ranges regulated by Idaho cities and counties right now? I would love to open a shooting range if it becomes unregulated!
I can support the concealed weapons issue. I just wish I had a handgun. Idaho should have a gun welfare program for those who want one (yeah like foodstamps, but guns!) 8^)
Aren’t there some requirements to earn a concealed weapons permit? No felonies, no domestic violence charges, had to take a gun safety or had military experience? Can anyone fill us in on those requirements?
It just seems like the concealed weapons approach is a band-aid. It seems like a quick and easy answer full of action but I don’t know how effective it would be.
It seems the real solutions to this problem are going to be the tough ones that we do not want to really do. Have other nations experienced campus shootings like America has? Is it a worldwide phenomenon or uniquely American?
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0 0 Joe no one really has all the answers. But for now a bandaide would be nice. Just let the bill pass and let us protect our selves for now since the state and county and campus police can’t. I think the school goes to far regulating a concealed permit that is issued by the county. Yes I agree with joe the concealed weapons on campus would be a quick fix but wont fix the entire problem. The shooter will still die there will still be a loss of life envolved. It would be better if newer affordable technologies came out that had non leathal applications. A sound weapon would be nice or a gun with electrical charged ammuniton would be great. A stun bullet. But for now we do not have those options yet. I think we need to fight fire with fire.
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0 0 “Guest” on 2/16 - excellent post. Couldn’t have said it better myself. I am a mom and I carry a gun (legally) in my vehicle at all times, and have taken several firearm safety and shooting classes. You defined the problem well.
Whatever happened to the numbers on the comments?
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0 0 If you wait for the government to protect you have a nice time waiting while some nut job shoots the place up. The government already issues concealed weapons licenses after background screening. That right should not cease at the college gate or classroom door.
Another poster also brought up how the Utah Legislature allowed concealed carry on campus for years—with no problems.
The Senate Bill would codify that local governments and universities could not prohibit carry on campus so long as a concealed weapon permit was in hand and they had reported their intent to the Admin to carry concealed.
We already know that statistics show a positive effect on crime reduction in states with right to carry laws vs. those that restrict handgun possession, i.e. Washington, D.C. is the murder capital of the US. Coincidentally, this is a big reason why some folks have now successfully challenged the handgun ban in DC at the DC Court of Appeals. It is now headed to the US Supreme Court.
Most of the crazed nuts that intend on shooting will not be detered by the threat that someone might be carrying. They simply won’t be thinking on that level. However, if students had the right and the opportunity to arm themselves without being in fear of getting expelled, perhaps they could put the shooter down before he killed numerous people. We will never know.
The bottom line here is that with background screening and record checks we hope to put weapons in the hands of trusted folks that care about their safety and those around them. It is not fail proof; however, we can’t put metal detectors and security guards at every entrance and exit. We also cannot predict when and where shooters will show up. For this reason, we need to allow people to defend themselves when and where they choose to. This is another area where the government should be encouraging people to take personal responsbility to protect themselves. The prime function of government is to protect it’s citizens from harm. When it cannot, it must get out of the way and allow it’s citizens to share the burden and the right to do what it cannot.
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0 0 Wow. Mike we usualy do not see eye to eye. But you definatly made a godo point. Thanks for the support. We are opening students for carrying concealed weapons at ISU if you would like to join our group here are the people to contact
Jared L Harward (Campus Leader)
Idaho State University
harwjare@isu.edu
John R Klein
Idaho State University
kleijohn@isu.edu
I was going to be the campus leader but I decided not to I am way to busy to run this lol.
Let these guys know if your interested in joining our Organization at ISU. We are just barely starting and I know we can make a difference. We are going to ralley and make law makers pass this bill.
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0 0 I just recalled a recent example of how private citizens arming themselves saved lives. Anyone recall how private citizens volunteering to conduct security at a Colorado Springs Church saved mass carnage by engaging a gunman as he entered the church tyring to kill people? The private citizen put the gunman down before he could kill numerous people. This is a great example of why people should be allowed to be armed and protect themselves.
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0 0 Mike I have wrote several e-mails to the white house asking for them to help with the college restraints on concealed weapons. I actualy got a good response.
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0 0 Here is another good story about Utah State University allowing concealed weapons on campus.
http://media.www.scccampusnews.com/media/storage/paper1165/news/2007/11/21/Opinion/Concealed.Weapons.On.Campus.Aid.In.SelfDefense-3112328.shtml
I think students need to file a tort claim against ISU for violating second ammendment rights. I am currently having a lawyer in the family draw up some papers. We are going to force them to allow concealed weapons on campus by filing and filing and filing until they break. Here is some more info on how successful it is to file against a college for this.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1818306/posts
its like under $40.00 to file one. You do not need a lawyer. The court has no choice but to award damages in you favor.
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0 0 live free- I am wondering how much you have really researched this issue based on a news story I saw last night. The news station (a local one, I forgot which) reported about the debate on guns on college campuses. Then they stated a little known fact people don’t realize. ISU does allow concealed weapons IF you have a CWP, and register/report you are carrying one to the Public Safety Office.
If this is the case, why would you be on this rampage to get them to allow guns, and waste the time of the “lawyer in your family”?
Unless the news made a mistake in their reporting, it seems like you are getting on a soapbox and going overboard. Myself, if someone has a CWP (shooting skills help too) and report they’re carrying to public safety, why do you have to go any further than this?
Enough of the tort claim threats, please. How many situations have you threatened to file torts in the past or successfully won? How many active in court do you have right now? Give me a break.
I think you’d be laughed out of court on this one, especially in Idaho. Especially if the rule is as the news reported.
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0 0 Reader: I couldn’t have said it better myself!! I laugh everytime I read about livefree filing another “tort claim” on this site. What’s he got 4 or 5 filed now?
The fact that he lied about “having a lawyer in the family” fight to get this law enacted is quite amusing, especially since your already allowed to have a concealed weapon on campus with a CWP. Any lawyer would already know this.
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0 0 I’m having a real hard time with guns being allowed on campus. Isn’t there a less deadly solution? What about tasers? I don’t know what the answer is to this growing problem. Right now I am just trying to come up with many solutions.
People like “live free” roaming around campus with a gun literally scares me to even think about it. What if I inadvertently cross his path, disagree with him on a political issue, or just happen to wear something he doesn’t think appropriate or like?
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0 0 CR67- yes, his rambling tirades are getting old. Reminds me of college days in the bars with my friends, when a table of guys got drunk and boasted and rambled on about nothing in particular, thinking they had solved all the worlds problems. (Ok, girls did it too but not as bad.)
Here’s what I found out before “live free” jumps on again and threatens a tort claim against all of us:
I called ISU and spoke with a public safety dispatcher. I asked about the news story and she said it was wrong, students cannot carry guns on campus at any time even with a CWP. I asked her about what the news reported, she said they were wrong.
I called Channel 8 to clarify they ran the story and the guy in the newsroom agreed that’s what they ran, that if you check in your gun with Public Safety and had a CWP, you CAN carry. He said they talked to the head of (or one of) Public Safety and that’s what he said. He was going to check further since I was told differently 2 minutes earlier.
Here is their policy, click on “Policies” - Weapons Storage Policy on the left column.
http://www.isu.edu/departments/pubsafe/
It does say you will not be permitted to carry “without permission of the director of public safety”. So does that mean you can if you have permission and a CWP? This is what channel 8 said. There are exceptions to the rule as you all can read, including storage of guns in vehicles allowed.
Either way, I would check into this more closely before hiring a lawyer and quoting a bunch of sites. But, if it’s less than $40 and so easy to do yourself, why don’t you? Like Idaho Native, with the way you freaked out at a daycare and rant and rave here, you carrying a gun on campus or anywhere really concerns me. You might want to get a grip on the anger issue first and your “everyone is evil and against me and my children” mentality. A gun won’t solve those problems for you.
Either way, I am glad I can lawfully carry a gun and I do. What scares me is mentally ill people who lie on an application, and other unstable people without criminal histories, like the recent college shooter. They’ll get one anyway, and so will anyone who wants a gun bad enough. My husband and I believe in being prepared for ANYTHING.
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0 0 Oh great the children are starting to form a gang against me on the site because they do not agree with what i said. I do not really care. and as for this comment
“Then they stated a little known fact people don’t realize. ISU does allow concealed weapons IF you have a CWP, and register/report you are carrying one to the Public Safety Office. ”
Um this is not true what so ever. ISU doesnt allow guns on campus at all. The news is miss informed and trust me it happens.
Why are you all attacking me for? Because I am willing to argue what I believe. Try doing the same with out the name calling. I know that it must have got to ya that I am right and your wrong so you start being childish and calling names and saying rude and childish things directly at me. I understand how children act when they do not get thier way. I am sitting here drinking my coffee and enjoying every second of this. Thanks for showing everyone how much mental illness is really on here ha ha ha. You should get some help for your Bi polar. People that act like this is more of a reason to carry concealed weapons. They are nuts and could hurt some one.
and as far as filing claims against the county I won 5,000.00 3 diferent times from them for illegal traffic stops lol. Harassment is the easiest one to win. All you need is a video camera and tape recorder do not let the officer know they are on and tape it all. lol
I am a master at suing people. Someone wrongs you Don’e kick thier butt sue it. Hit them in the wallet.
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0 0 Hey, Livefree! Stop stealing my thunder.
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0 0 Uhhhh, I WOULD be interested knowing how you won those cases. That pay beats mine!
I find it most interesting the discrepancy here between what one person was told at ISU public safety and what Local News 8 reported they were told by ISU public safety. I imagine the news went to the head of their office and the person who said “not a chance” may not be aware their head can make exceptions.
I look forward to hearing the true answer.
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0 0 I called public safety 2 mins ago ang confirmed that. NO WEAPONS ARE ALLOWED ON CAMPUS PERIOD!!!!!! they just told me that on the phone. if you do not believe me call the ISU help desk and have them transfer you to public safety 282-2700 The only way to carry a gun is you have to get permition from the school and they will not give permition period. So you have to sue them for violating your constitutional rights and hit them in the wallet several times until they give in. The more people that file against them the easier it will be.
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0 0 I seriously doubt you’ve won 3 tort claims. And what would an upstanding adult (with children no less) be doing with a video camera running in his car. You’re so full of it you’re starting to believe your own lies.
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0 0 Well this should be interesting if Local News 8 runs a correction to their previous report.
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0 0 Hey what was that website where you could see all the cases by county? Give us the case numbers so we can see how you won all those cases and made the big bucks. PUSU.
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0 0 yeah, that’ll happen!
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0 0 I have refrained from commenting on this thread for some time for reasons I wish to remain private. However, I’d like to discuss the underlying issue here, that being: are guns for self-defense something we want to promote as a culture? The second amendment was written to protect against aggressive government, not against school shootings or muggings or robberies.
I may be a little outside the box, but I for one could not kill another human, even if that person were trying to kill me. Almost every culture has this moral teaching, but few practice it across the board. Therefore I have no need to carry a handgun outside the home. I’m all for tasers, however.
I believe the “kill them before they kill you” attitude is perpetuating the tolerance of murder and violence in our culture. Incest seems to be more of an abhorrance than killing! I think the only solution to the obscenity of murder is to wholeheartedly treat all killing as an insurmountable moral violation - punishable by complete social exclusion.
Our government isn’t even close in this regard. We still pride ourselves as the best country in the world at killing those that pester us. The Department of Defense (more like offense) puts a lot more money into killing the bad guys than simply disabling and deterring them.
So, do you agree? If so or if not, what is the best way for us to tackle the root cause - the fact that too many individuals resort to killing as a means to an end?
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0 0 One of the other issues discussed after every shooting is our country’s (and our state’s) lack of mental health counseling. We make fun of mental health issues, we stigmatize mental health, people lose promotions and jobs if they seek counseling, etc.
An increased mental health climate would seem to attack the root cause of these shootings. And that involves spending more money on subjective things like counseling, and our society being more understanding of folks who need counseling. But that involves hard work and lots of money. We like easy answers like “arm everyone to the teeth for a shootout”.
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0 0 Bobbydigital, you got it! The 2nd amendment was set up so we could defend ourselves against the doggone government, not against each other.
But that having been said, the concept of outlawing guns (I used to be a handgun control supporter, but I became more libertarian as years went by) seems abhorrent to me, even though I do not own any myself and haven’t even been hunting for 35 years.
I just don’t know what the answer is. If I could afford a taser I’d probably get one. (I guess the next thought is how can I NOT afford one, for protection?) But I’d be more afraid of being caught in the crossfire of a shootout, than being one guy’s target, on a school campus.
Everyone’s tendency is to run when a shooter presents himself. What if several jumped the guy instead? Somebody will get shot, but then, this will happen even if everybody runs.
I have no idea how I would respond. I’d probably run, so there goes my brilliant idea. 
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0 0 I have won 3 of them in the past all for harassment and wrong doing of local police. But that has been over the last three years or so and giving you this information will give you my real name so some of you mentaly ill people might try to attack me and really open a can of worms. I do have a concealed weapons permit and would really like to avoid anyone trying to cause me harm forcing my hand. You are getting out of topic here lets focus on concealed weapons in schools. I have never been in jail but I have heard of a law that still stands in Idaho. I havent confirmed it I would love to see someone check into it. It suposedly says when you are released from jail they are supposed to give you a rifle and a horse. I think you can file a tort claim for that and win the amount or value of a good rifle and horse. The state most of the time doesnt fight claims they just pay it to avoid any media attention. they just settle it. Now back to the gun issue.
There is only one point here I am going to make then I am dropping out of this topic.
No one can protect students from being victims from rape, murder, or harm. I think since no one else can protect us students its time to let the students protect them selves. Period.
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0 0 I don’t Local News 8 will have to do a correction.
Here’s why:
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0 0 Very good thought, Joe! We still haven’t figured out as a society that where health is concerned (mental and physical), an ounce of prevention is worth a ton of cure. But how can we all afford to go to the mental health counselor as often as we go to the barber shop? Do psychiatrists have “nurses” that can do the majority of screening and basic counseling? I think free mental checkups would solve a lot of our relationship problems, as well!
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0 0 Joe,
Regarding the Mental Health comment, I think most would agree that having a mental illness and/or taking meds for it does not carry as much stigma as it used to. Another element here is that several of these shooters have served time in a psychiatric ward. That being the case, this information should have been communicated to the FBI so it could go into the database to restrict gun and ammo purchases. However, because of HIPPA laws and rights to privacy this hasn’t been done. So, the mentally ill still have their right to privacy and the ability to buy guns….and use them at our expense. In my opinion, that is fast becoming the root of the problem. We are more interested in preserving the right to privacy for mentally ill folks than protecting public safety. We can see the results of that silly policy.
The Second Amendment does address government not being able to take weapons away. However, it is a stretch to say that it doesn’t apply amongst a fight between private persons defending themselves….that linkage doesn’t even make sense.
The second amendment wording has nothing to do with beefs between private persons nor does it affect one’s ability to defend themselves with weapons of their choosing: guns, knives, sticks, etc….that is a specious argument put forward by gun control advocates that don’t like guns and don’t believe people should defend themselves. Try that argument on for size when a prowler is coming into your house at 3 a.m.! I am not going to quote the Second Amendment to my uninvited house guest and pray that he won’t use a gun on me.
If I want to protect myself from harm who are you to tell me that I can’t? (so long as I am not a convicted criminal or mental case) What “right” in the Constitution gives you or anyone else to tell me I can’t protect myself by whatever means possible. I am not infringing on your right to choose not to carry–yet, many want to impose their beliefs and agenda on me and others that choose to protect ourselves with guns. It’s about taking personal responsibilty to defend ourselves, our families and friends from people that have no respect for boundaries and our rights. Some want to call it arming to the teeth….I call it prevention and perserverence. It is not an “easy” answer to the problem…having to kill anyone would never be my choice….but it would be my immediate reaction if someone tried to kill me and my family. So, don’t use the Constitution to tell me by what means I can or cannot defend myself. Most certainly, I am not going to depend on the police to help. They are overburdened and spread too thin. I am not going to sit on 911 while somebody shoots me. I am going to act.
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0 0 good point Mike. I like what the ISU fire arms site has to say about being able to pack a gun on campus. here it is ” No student shall be permitted to carry firearms or other weapons, concealed or not concealed, with or without a concealed weapon permit, while upon properties owned or controlled by the university without permission from the Director of Public Safety”
permission from the Director of Public Safety
permission from the Director of Public Safety
I am going to try this next
I will keep everyone posted if I get the permition or not. It doesnt hurt to try. The dean of students already says no lets see whats public safety says.
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0 0 I can’t stop laughing about livefree and his “tort claims”!! Think I’ll get thrown in the drunk tank tonight just so I can bail out tomorrow and get me a rifle and a good horse! Or was that a good rifle and a horse? (or the monetary equivelant!)
It’s people like Livefree that get in minor fender benders and lay on the ground claiming their back is hurt just so they can sue the insurance companies. And we wonder why our premiums are so high. Thank you livefree.
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0 0 I did not once claim it was correct I only said someone commented on that saying it was. I also said someone should check into it and see if its true or not. Read my entire post before commenting please. I would also like to point out that being a problem on here is some people do not read the entire thread and like to make ignorant comments. Read what I said first please. Thank you. I was expecting people to hate me because I do love my freedom to make my own choices. And people will always want to control others choices. I am glad that we live in a democracy and we have choices.
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0 0 Joe can you please post a link to channel 8 news saying it was ok to carry concealed weapons on campus?
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0 0 You are right, the second amendment does not discriminate or delineate, but the original purpose was to protect individuals against their government. Protecting individuals against each other is the job of the states. Neither the constitution nor most states ban “kill them before they kill you,” but moral teachings across the world tell us never to kill anyone. Isn’t it time that we as a society embrace this basic moral teaching?
I have no problem with keeping a gun in the home or using one hunting, but I will never use one to kill another for the sole selfish purpose of saving my humble life.
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0 0 That’s where you and I differ. If somebody is in my house attacking me or my family, your damn skippy I’m gonna shoot to kill! And I won’t think twice about it.
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0 0 Ok the constitution does say guns are to defend us from our government. but our government is our other people. They are people too. We the people. So technicaly we are the government and defending ourselves against each other is the same.
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0 0 Oh, live_free, that’s a stretch…we the people. hee hee.
If we the people are the government, then guns are to defend us against ourselves, too!
Guess I may not buy that taser, I’d probably just end up using it against myself after all.
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I’m against concealed weapons on the campus. That isn’t the answer. It will only make the guns easier for these punks to get. What happens if someone snaps during class? Has an argument over a girlfriend or what have you? If we let students carry guns on campus it’s going to be the wild wild west all over again and thats not then environment I want my kids living in.
If we’d stop sensationalizing these little punks every time they go off on a rampage, maybe they’d realize what a waste it would be. Knowing their not going to get one shred of coverage from any news outlet. Until THAT happens, we’re going to continue to see these shootings. However, concealed weapons is not the answer. Perhaps for the teachers, but definately not the students. What happened to putting metal detectors in the classrooms? After columbine, high schools everywhere were getting metal detectors as were some colleges. We seemed to have forgotten that very simple, yet effective option, opting instead for concealed weapons for basically teenagers. YEAH…THAT WILL SOLVE THE PROBLEM!