Find sex-offenders in your neighborhood

Good idea but you only get part of the picture from this. What many don’t realize is that a lot of the times the molestors are able to get plea bargains to avoid the sex offender registry - and thats not always the fault of the police / prosecutor. The guy who lives across the street from me molested his step daughter and was arrested for it. In the meantime the stepdaughter went to live across country with her real father who wouldn’t bring her back for a trial. So the molestor got the charges reduced from a felony lewd and lacivious charge to a misdemeanor battery charge- no different than if he had punched someone. He is a child molestor and he shows up on no lists. There are many more just like him.

Post Register ran a good story last Sunday about juvenile sex offenders. Not many, but hey keep an eye on them also. The link is http://isp.state.id.us/so_viewer/search.jsp, click on ‘Juvenile’ and search in your county

The site posted in the original post refers back to the Idaho State Police site for pictures and further info on a person. I like the ISP site to use from the get go - it seems to be the most complete. It also has info on Idaho missing kids, adults, etc.
http://www.isp.state.id.us/identification/sex_offender/index.html

I think that child molesters should be shot. All of them deserve a sudden or fatal death.

Casteration isnt enough for the child predator. They need to be delt with by the public. Lynch mobs would be the best way to deal with them.

Some 13 year old kid molested my 4 year old daughter and I couldnt get the police to do anything.

That punk will get his real soon. Keep an eye on the news. 13 year old boy gets raped by several large black males. That would be real funny.

Not fatal death! Give them death, but for heaven’s sake, don’t make it fatal!

Yes that is a good way to go. we will need to classify the differerence between 19y/o with 14 y/o girlfriend v/s hardcore molesters, or are they all the same that is a whole different subject altogether.alot of these young relationships are on the crime register now.

I agree with post #12! My Dad was accussed by his granddaughter (my niece) of molesting her and after a year of humiliation, lie detection tests, counseling of the child, etc, it was later found out that it was in fact her own father that had done the molesting! Not only to her, but her two sister, and a couple of cousins! He is currently in prison serving 30 years. To this day my Dad refuses to be alone with any of my brothers children because of this crazy sceniario!
People are falsely accused all the time!
Those that are truly guilty should indeed pay for their crimes, but all to often innocent people have had their lives turned upside down by an accusation alone.

Reoffense or “Recidivism” Rates of Sex Offenders
According to a recent report by the US Department of Justice, Bureau of Justice Statistics, “Of the 9,691 released sex offenders, 3.5% (339 of the 9,691) were reconvicted for a sex crime within the 3-year follow-up period.” It also states, “Within the first 3 years following their release from prison in 1994, 5.3% (517 of the 9,691) of released sex offenders were rearrested for a sex crime.”

In United States v. Mound, 157 F.3d 1153, 1154, (8th Cir. 1998) (en banc), four dissenting Judges cite Law Review articles citing statistics finding the recidivism rate of released sex offenders is the second lowest rate of recidivism of all convicted felons. In State v. Krueger, Case No. 76624 (December 19, 2000, Eighth Judicial District of Ohio, unreported), two female Judges reversed a Sexual Predator adjudication, finding the statute is based on a false assumption and in essence, an “old wives tale” of popular beliefs contradicted by empirical data.

By writing the National Criminal Justice Reference Center, P.O. Box 6000, Rockville, Maryland 20849-6000, you can obtain the following reports.

NCJ-163392 (February 7, 1997), Sex Offenses and Offenders: An Analysis of Data on Rape and Sexual Assault, finds the recidivism rate of 2,214 convicted rapists released from prison was 7.7% after three years. The only category of crimes with a lower recidivism rate are those persons convicted of murder (6.8%).

NCJ-193427 (June, 2002), Recidivism of Prisoners Released in 1994, finds the recidivism rate of 3,138 convicted rapists released from prison was 2.5% after three years. The only category of crimes with a lower recidivism rate are those persons convicted of murder (1.2%).

In April, 2001, the Ohio Department of Rehabilitation and Correction (ODRC) released a report also on the recidivism rate of released sex offenders. In Ten-Year Recidivism Follow-Up of 1989 Sex Offender Releases, Office of Policy, Bureau of Planning and Evaluation, Paul Konicek, Principle Researcher, (available at http://www.drc.state.oh.us), the recidivism rate of 879 sex offenders released from Ohio’s prisons in 1989, after ten (10) years, was found to be 8% for new sex offenses.

The ODRC study finds its results as typical, citing to:

1) Gibbons, Soothill, and Way, found in Furby, Weinrott & Blackshaw, 1989. (Twelve year study finding sex offender recidivism rate of 4%).

2) Gibbons, Soothill, and Way 1980, found in Furby, Weinrott & Blackshaw, 1989. (Thirteen year study finding sex offenders recidivism rate of 12%).

3) Hanson & Bussiere, 1996. (Mega-analysis of sixty-one sex offender studies with a total of 28,972 sex offenders finding recidivism rate for new sex offenses five years after release was 13.4%).

4) New York Department of Corrections, nine year follow-up study. Finding a 6% rate of recidivism for new sex offenses.

These studies are cited on page 11 of the ODRC report.

At page 15 of the report, the overall findings are summarized. The ODRC finds, “Contrary to the popular idea that sex offenders are repeatedly returning to prison for further sex crimes, in this population a sex offender recidivating for a new sex offense within 10 years of release was a relatively rare occurrence.” Id. at page 15, ¶ 4.

( Love 2002 )

This is in stark contrast to what is presented by politicians and the mainstream media. The amount of occurrences of violent, brutal rape and murder of children is minute. Unfortunately, the public pays the price for this massive and ongoing campaign of misinformation in multiple ways:

Firstly, the public funds the registry (staff to keep up with the registrants, etc.), secondly, the public is subject to loss of property values (due to proximity of a registered sex offender) and thirdly, an increased level of anxiety with little benefit from the knowledge.

SOhopeful International seeks to strengthen Megan’s Law by excluding low risk former sex offenders, and only register and track those deemed qualified under the original stated legislative intent. It does the public no real good to have to wade through 95 lowest risk former offenders to find the 3.5 who are considered a risk to reoffend.

I appreciate your researched comment, khan.

I may not interpret it correctly, but I read the studies varying in the recidivism rates, from 2.5% to 13.4%.

If the rates are due to time studied after jail release, there is still a problem. One study claims 4% recidivism in a 12-year study, and another claims a 12% recidivism in a 13-year study. Do 8% of sex offenders suddenly devolve in that thirteenth year?

To my mind, 10% recidivism of 1,000 sex offenders means 100 more kids or adults will be sexually violated, and it could have been prevented with stronger treatment or punishments of the offenders. 100 more people is too many in my mind.

I can appreciate the arguments about the costs of running the registry, and the problems of statutory rape.

I think the state should quit prosecuting and registering people if they are guilty of statutory rape if the ‘victim’ is within 2 or 3 years age, unless the victim is 14 or under. For example, my neighbor convicted of statutory rape with a 16 year old when he was 26 would still be rape.

We could cut consensual teen sex partners out of the equation and focus on the real problems.

In fact, I wonder how many of these recidivism rate studies included or excluded people convicted of statutory rape with someone within 2 or 3 years of their own age? I imagine the people in this category are not major sex offenders and probably would not repeat offend.

So I agree and disagree with you. I disagree in that I see the studies as inconclusive, albeit I will agree recidivism is probably not higher than 20%. I disagree that it is all hype and fear, because the few victims of recidivism are the few too many.

I will agree that we could purge the list of those most unlikely to offend again (statutory rape offenders within 2 or 3 years of their victim’s age), then we could focus on the real potential re-offenders.

I’ve often wondered why there’s not more external, objective investigation going on w/ the Drug Court situation here in IF/Bonneville County. Their recidivism rates as is are dismal, their costs per client are outrageous, they use “canned” programs delivered to relatively huge groups, yet they get more and more money while legitimate and needed programs, such as ARA, struggle month to month. You’d think the PR would be all over this…

The PR is soft on sex offenders. They believe they should be treated before they should be incarcerated. They also love Drug Court and won’t attack or even question the results, i.e. bang for the buck….even if they did the way the stats are accumulated the picture is distorted in their favor.

Hokay…PR: 6.18.06:

Since Felony Drug Court began in June of 2000, it has graduated twenty-eight people, nine of whom reoffended. Fifty were terminated, but I know as a fact that very few of these individuals were actually referred back to prison. Most were referred to other community-sourced treatment programs so the argument about their drug court stays being cheaper than prison isn’t really applicable.

Seems to me that the cost for twenty-eight graduates over seven years at your stated budget allocation (assuming similar amounts per year) is, uh, extraordinary….

JMO

The point is that the community does have a right to know and protect themselves because the government has demonstrated that it cannot and does not protect us from predators in the community.

Second, society does treat most sex offenders as just that…they have offended sexually! There are differences in registration requirements for violent sexual predators vs. the ‘regular’ predators. There are also provisions in place for offenders to petition the courts after 10 years of good conduct to remove themselves from the registration requirement.

The community has a right to know and both actual offenders and potential predators know that if you do the crime that you do the time and have to have your picture plastered everywhere. It’s an old scarlet letter version of shaming those that offended against the community.

Frankly, we got too far away from this…it’s high time that we got back to more community involvement and knowledge of what is going on and who the criminals are. It is problematic to rely on the government for our safety. Notification is a good thing….throwing some ’sunshine’ on the dark deeds done by predators helps more than it harms anything. Mica, the motivation is simple: We don’t fully trust the government to protect us and want to take more of the responsibility on ourselves!

I agree that we are worrying ourselves needlessly over many offenders that are not a real threat. I would like to see the law changed to exempt statutory rape in cases where the “victim” is within 12 months age of the perpetrator.

However, we’ve seen too many cases nationwide where sex offenders re-offended again in their neighborhoods, and nobody had a clue about the offender’s past.

I agree with Mike and the guest.

I think we should start a new sex offender requirement, whereby once a month in each zip code an “open house” is held say at the courthouse or wherenot, where all sex offenders in a zip code have to show up for public display.

Maybe display isn’t the right word, perhaps inspection is. People can change their appearance dramatically from their mugshots, and being able to see these perps monthly gives us a better idea of what they look like currently, so we can watch for them in our parks.

I see this event also providing information on the offenses of each offender, ordered by severity. This way we can see all the statutory rapers in one area and probably ignore them. We can focus on the lewd and lascivious and rapers in one area and make sure we can recognize them in public.

Require the offenders to go to these public inspections once per month, mandatory with one absence allowed per year.

What do you think?

“I think we should start a new sex offender requirement, whereby once a month in each zip code an “open house” is held say at the courthouse or wherenot, where all sex offenders in a zip code have to show up for public display.”

Should we have dunkings and change the name of the town to Salem?

Apparently there is someone else signing in on my registered name (Paula) #28 is NOT me.

Its a Paula world.

(no I’m neither of them either but I couldn’t resist)

This does raise an interesting point. I like being able to be anonymous but at the same time it shouldn’t be so easy to imitate someone else.

I’ll look at code to reserve usernames.

I agree with CR67. I didn’t know that this young man that did this to my daughter was one, nor did anyone else. The probation officer didn’t even inform anyone. So whose fault should be blamed there. If anyone knew about the man that did this my daughter, I can guarantee he wouldn’t have been dropped off at someones house because he had a family fight and couldn’t stay at his home he would have been back in jail and my daughter would still be my little girl. Always ask if you have any doubts, if I would have known any kind of information that he wasn’t to be around any minor girls I would have asked and thrown a fit until someone answered and found somewhere else for him to go.

The really sick ones do it again, statistics or not. Remember, statistics represent the REPORTED facts, not what is kept secret. There are men and women out there who fantasize, plan, etc. even while they are in prison or therapy! Take it from a counselor on this one.

I agree, look at their offenses and be the judge. Pull the record for details if you wish. The 17 year old boy and his 15 year old girlfriend are not the ones to worry about. It’s the guy who is 50 with stat rape or whatever on his list.

Better to over-react and be watchful of our children than under-react and take a blaise attitude. Then you’ll surely find your little girl or boy violated or worse, forever.

More important that running around shouting statistics is to look at the real crimes these people commit. Usually it is not just one victim. There are scores of victims that have been perpetrated before an arrest. Whether it is one, three, five, or fifty victims, the point is that each “statistical” point represents a child being abused. It could be mine, yours, or a close friends child. US Dept. of Justice studies on the topic show that most recidivism rates for known pedophiles interested in 0 to 14 age range recidivate at greater than 28%. Hebophiles, interested in pre-pubescent 14 to 18, recidivate at slightly lower rate of 22%. If you consider these statistics to be acceptable and not as great as 90% bravo! You have just accepted the fact children are continually abused by persons who don’t deserve a jail cell…they deserve a grave!

The other statement that Anonymous made was: “Megan’s Law, and others like it, have had no appreciable effect on reducing recidivism, already low to begin with.”

…this statement is laughable because of one little critical fact…most laws set up were named for Megan Kanka…sexually assaulted and murdered, I believe, within the last 5 years. There have not been any appreciable studies done in this area to measure the effects of Megan’s Laws because they are relatively new and evolving. This is pure hot air being bellowed by this fellow. What a slap in the face to victims and their families to say recidivism is low enough already. You should be ashamed of yourself…Mr./Ms. Anonymous…wake up and smell the coffee….any kind of sexual abuse is intolerable. Society must take even stronger steps to put these jerks away before they can hurt anyone else.

Governor Otter and the Legislature have not done everything that they can possibly do to strengthen Idaho’s Laws. A good start would be to impose mandatory minimums on pedophiles and certain hebophiles.

BTW2, your commentary re- the applicability of research re- Megan’s Laws is uninformed, to say the least.

The true face-slapping comes when people such as yourself don’t care enough about the victims of all crimes to proffer informed commentary.

That is all.

“Obviously”? Interesting into what you are reading my posts to state. Particularly in light of the concurrence re- the dangerousness of “hysteria” re- this issue.

Also, loved the debate technique of accusing the opponent of the topical behavior; a technique used far and wide by people without much else upon which to support their opinion.

BTW3, your method of watching the convicted and registered is, as shown by research, pointless, given that most offenses are not perpetrated by recidivators.

Good job w/ that critical thought process, though!

LOL…your tone and accusations certainly betray your true willingness to listen and discuss; they’ve already impaired your ability to comprehend simple English.

Good luck with the Witch Hunt (at least until they come looking for you)!

I’m out to start confrontation? Who has called the other names? Who has presented inflammatory stereotypes, generalizations, and prejudices in their arguments? Who has misread and quoted others’ posts out of context?

Hmmmm…….

We know Jer has no children so he does not have the feeling most of us have for innocents. His defense of sexual perverts is astonishing. I don’t care if a pervert does get treatment, he will offend again it’s just a matter of time. Kill them or lock them up with each other for life, but keep them off my streets.

Poster for #51, please clarify…are you insinuating that ‘Anonymous’ is Jer (Jeremy?). I am confused on that one. THanks.

Man, what a mess made of such a simple issue. Anonymous is too busy trying to show the world he bought that new “Word Power” CD to even apply any of that brain power to the subject at hand. Its as simple an issue as it gets. Do they (child molesters) re-offend or do they not? Are treatments and therapy 100% effective or are they not? Will we as a society tolerate these perverts victimizing our innocent young or will we not? Any person who commits what I will call a “lower level sex crime” — like an 18 or 19 year old having consentual sex with his 17 year old girlfriend should have a much lesser sentance and no mandatory registration for life in my opinion. However, any person who is convicted of a serious sex crime against a child (and the courts or the people should decide where the breaking points will be) should never walk on our streets again — PERIOD. End of story. I don’t care about therapy, and cure rates and your statistics or your fancy words. If there is even the SLIGHTEST chance that a person will re-offend (or “recidivate” for the brain surgeons out there) then that person should NEVER get out of prison. Not ever! even after one offense. It is not worth the risk to our children. Unless a Doctor can guarantee that a given criminal has been cured without any doubt, why should we take the risk? Can he live next door to your kids? I don’t want him anywhere near mine! Its just that simple. And as far as the mandatory registrations go — whatever it takes. They shouldn’t have their freedom anyway, so i don’t want to hear them cry about registration. if they were convicted of hurting a child it is not out of line to have some life long reprocussions. Its a pretty small price to pay for having done what they did — and still being allowed to walk our streets, near our chilrdren.

Excellent post Feelinlucky. And once again Mr Anonymous hides behind his anonymity while still dodging the questions everyone has asked him. Which just makes you wonder why he’s so concerned about these perverts feelings and their freedoms.
Personally I could care less if these perverts never “recidivate” again….once is enough in my book and I don’t want them anywhere near my kids!

I think our PR Editor Kortney put it really well in stating, most people don’t take too much stock in posters that hide behind their anonymity anyways.
As for myself and the other concerned parents see it, we’ll continue to keep any eye on this registry while keeping both eyes out for our childrens wellbeing.

If you have been on this site long enough to have read many of my posts, you’ll find my email address in a couple of them. I have nothing to hide. Regular posters here know my name and where I come from, how long I’ve lived here and whatnot. Plus I speak my mind here without any regrets and don’t dance around the issues like you do. (which you’ve managed to do yet again!)

Once again….you continue to dodge the questions, but that’s ok….its obvious you’re only out to start arguments and bash other posters for their beliefs.
WHY would I change my opinion towards a pervert that likes to molest little boys and girls?? It’ll never happen so you might as well get used to it.
Good day to you, and I’ll be sure to keep an eye out for you on the registry.

Rather than grandstanding about one’s superior knowledge and avoidance tactics, let’s get back on topic.

Fact is, no one can predict 100% exactly who will re-offend. But, there are some pretty good tests and measures one can use while treating a sex offender, in therapy or in prison.

As I said earlier, unless you have personally tried to treat or counsel a victim or an offender, you really can’t speak to their mindset. I can tell you for a fact a lot of offenders are infatuated with the idea of sex with children, even during therapy. It’s an addiction to them, a physical and mental need, like gambling or nicotine.

And the poor kids, geez, their family is threatened, they are violated or physically hurt, and pretty messed up for a long time. Come on, who deserves more rights here?

There are a lot of parents out there who don’t take the time to go over (and over) with their children the subject of good touches and bad touches. And it never ceases to amaze me the weirdos moms and dads trust to take care of their kids, even for an hour. Some parents really need to wise up as to who is watching their kids. Other times, you have no idea.

In some states you have to register as a sex offender if you are convicted of urinating in public! I also worked with a 16 year old boy who had to stay registered until he was in his mid 20’s, all for having concensual sex with a 14 year old girl, who admitted she led him on and did everything she could to get him in bed. I think the laws need to be written and punishment doled out differently for this type of crime versus the 30 year old who loves little grade school boys and girls.

That’s all I wanted to know in the first place: Why anonymous feels the way he does regarding his opinion and/or feelings on the issue. But instead of giving us that information, he’d rather bash mine and others views.

The point I and other parents were trying to make is, it doesn’t matter if a sexual predator is going to recidivate again or not, if they did it once I personally don’t want them around my child. I wasn’t trying to dictate what they could or couldn’t do, or where they could or couldn’t live, just so long as they continue to enforce this registry so I’m aware of where they ARE living. I believe its our right as tax paying ciizens be informed of the whereabouts of these criminals.

I know first hand how it affects the victim and their families and for someone to stand up for these sick individuals just blows my mind! And those who don’t know, all you have to do is watch a few episodes of “Datelines, To Catch a Predator” to see the extent of this problem, and to what lengths these sickos will go to in order to fuel their addiction.

I think its a real shame that some people oppose the registration process these people have to go through every time they move to a new town or residence, but really…who’s fault is that? Just don’t expect me to apologize for my feelings on this issue. And don’t do the crime if you aren’t ready to deal with the consequences. And if someone is getting help with their problem than that’s great and I commend their efforts. But I still want to know where their living and if its anywhere near my neighborhood. I’m willing to bet if we took a poll, the majority of the parents on this site would back me on this issue.

Ah, once again, Peter V. pops up to offer his sex offender colony. A pure nut case! For those of you who would deny registered sex offenders any rights, re-read your U.S. Constitution and U.S. Bill of Rights and perhaps the Federalist Papers. The Bill of Rights was not written to give the majority rights. By definition,the majority rules in a democracy. The Bill of Rights was written to give the MINORITY rights, otherwise, they would be abridged and stomped on by the tyranny of the majority.

So all this talk of putting registered sex offenders in colonies is just window dressing - they’re really concentration camps. And then when they’re up and running (assuming the majority of politicians are willing to subvert the Constitution), who’s next? (If you have ever studied Nazi Germany or visited a concentration camp, you would know that Hitler picked unpopular groups of people to imprison and kill first before working on Jews.)

I also wanted to respond to some of the previous commenters. I don’t know about Idaho, but in California where I live, many of the people required to register are not child molesters, or at least not what society thinks of when it thinks of child molesters - an adult molesting a child. So this state’s list incorporates many who are low or no risk or those who do not pose risks to women and children. But they’re listed, alongside the dangerous child molesters. And the public, looking at the list, has no idea. The state hasn’t shown any interest in classifying them, probably because it would cost too much money and it’s unwilling to spend the money. There is a law which requires it to do so (by 2010), but my guess is it will get pushed back.

Secondly, someone noted that registered sex offenders have committed a lot of crimes, as reported by the national media. I think I have seen fewer than 10 in 5 years. That’s compared to the hundreds and thousands committed by those close to the child: parents, step parents, family friends, Scout leaders, teachers, youth pastors, babysitters, older brothers, etc. Women also are much more at risk of rape from those they know (dates and friends) than the proverbial “stranger in the alley.”

The recidivism rate for sex offenders is also MUCH lower than reported in the media. For example, the media will report on one high profile case (John Couey or Joseph Duncan), and since they were already registered, society will think that all registered sex offenders are like them. This is clearly not the case. An analogy would be to say that all convicted shoplifters are like serial bank robbers, and we should just lock them up in case these shoplifters become bank robbers. I am not offering this analogy because I equate property theft with molestation. My point is that in society’s view, all sex offenders are considered the “worst of the worst” and we need to protect ourselves because sooner or later they will also behave like Couey or Duncan.

If that were the case, this country would be bombarded with stories like the victims in these two criminals’ cases. Both occurred two or three years ago, and the media is still talking about it.

I liked the metaphor a Skeptical Inquirer writer used last fall in describing this issue. When is society going to stop paying attention to the burning match in front of it (registered sex offenders) and turn around and address the blazing forest behind it(the real danger - people who are not identified who pose the real risk.)

It’s almost as if society REFUSES to deal with the issue, preferring to think that strangers commit all these heinous crimes. It’s a head in the sand approach that refuses to address reality - that familiar adults are committing these molestations and rapes.

Maybe we don’t want to recognize that people we think are trustworthy are the real monsters.

Joe, this guy is obviously minimizing the problems sex offenders have caused, and do cause in the future. Don’t apologize for being rabid in protecting our children. People can still have certain rights enforced. I don’t agree with colonizing these people. It is unworkable. However, registration lists are important. This guy would have us all believe that registered offenders are not the real problem. Well, we know they have been a problem and we have to keep an eye on them.

As for his suggestion to look at the other persons who are not registered offenders…how do we keep an eye on them? Better education of parents and others of what to watch for in typical grooming behavior exercised by perverts in the making. We don’t have to shoot one idea down, i.e. registration to have the other. People forget, we had to fight for years to get the public access to registrations. It was a long road filled by repeat offenders victimizing kids. Idaho does classify offenders in it’s prisons. These classifications are used by the parole board and are also used to designate Violent Sexual Predator Status that requires more frequent registration and newspaper notification.

So, do we want to go back to the dark times where we had our heads buried in the sand and didn’t know about offenders in our midst? I don’t think this helps parents or children. While Mica is correct that many offenders are known to their victims this does not equate registration lists are a bad thing.

To my knowledge, there is only one guy that is advocating such a camp. Nobody else seriously believes in such a thing. This thread is about community safety being improved by sexual offender registration lists being available to the public. The one thing that has not been talked about by anyone here yet is community notification. Community notification is where the authorities canvas the neighborhood(s) where offenders live and physically make contact with neighbors to report a sex offender lives near them. Based on the danger level presented by the offender (as screened by a classificataion board) the notification is either blockwide, or within 1/2 a mile of the offender. Idaho does not have community notification (other than newspaper postings for violent sexual predators). Oregon does for varying types of offenders. Should this be utilized in Idaho?

I agree with 80% of what Babs said with the exception about the mentally ill part. Granted, there are a small portion of offenders that are mentally ill. However, placing this label on the rest of them implies that they can and should be ‘treated’. I don’t buy it. Most of them are not mentally ill. They are capable of controlling themselves until they think they won’t get caught. They are predators and plain evil in our midst. They are out for power and control and have no empathy for others. They are selfish and destructive. It’s all about what pleasures them at the expense of others. This is not mental illness, it is perversity in action with a purpose. Tell me that guys like Ted Bundy were mentally ill. We want to try and understand this behavior so we label it mental illness. WRONG! Call it what it is: Criminal behavior! Otherwise, we will be allowing every therapist to get in their and try to cure these criminals. I like what Dr. Stanton Samenow said about educating and treating criminals: When you get done all you have is a better educated and manipulative criminal.

Sorry Babs, most of these folks are bad people. They don’t have a mental defect. They have a defect of character and compassion for the thoughts and feelings of others. This makes them dangerous, not mentally ill.

Thanks Anonymous….that was really nice of you to say.

Ok…so, what’s your beef? If you are the same “Anonymous” in the earlier posts why don’t you offer some more Anonomizer for all of us to digest? Surely you can do better than attacking my ‘clear line of thoughts’?

No, my MO is understanding when people really want to discuss an issue versus when they just want to spew nonsense.

One person referred to me as a guy. Actually, I am a middle aged woman. And no I am not a registered sex offender, nor do I know any. But I do know about public policy, having studied it and reported on it as a journalist, and I know when something isn’t working.

Mike, you are twisting my words, or maybe my intent. I am referring to the hysteria over the harm that registered sex offenders supposedly pose to children when the greatest majority (80-90% according to reliable sources) of new cases each year are committed by people NOT on a registry. And most of these people are already known to the child. So the RSO down the street may be the first choice for everyone to suspect when a child is abused, but 8 times out of 10, he or she isn’t.

My main contention with the public registries is that in many states, mine included, they incorporate people who do not pose risks to children or women, but are people who are convicted of a “sex” offense. That’s not right to include many of those people. Those registries need to be weeded out and only include the repeat offenders and child molesters, like the kind of people who do have it “on their brain.” Having everyone convicted of any “sexual” offense gives the public a false sense of exactly who is a “sex” offender.

The reason the states do list all offenders or include more types of offenses is that the feds pay them to do so. The more names, the more money. In Florida, its list is padded with guys who are dead, just passing through on vacation, or in jail. It’s a cynical grab for money.

Hi Mica,

can you give us some basis for the claim that the feds “pay the state” to maintain the sex offender registry on a per offender basis? It is usually a function of the state or county; not sure where there would be federal money, on a “per offender listed” basis?????

Mike, thank you for your support; I do still stand by my “mental illness” statement….pedophillia (I’m quite sure I mis-spelled that…) is a recognized illness in the DSM-Iv or V or VI or whatever we are up to now….so is sociopathic personality disorder….

I do not think such people can be ‘cured’ in the truest sense of the word….the “treatment” would be close monitoring and perhaps medication …..but they won’t be cured, hence the need for protective measures such as the sexual offender registry….I am hesitant about the efficacy of civil commitment……

Joe, in reference to your comment: “I’m reminded of several times in my life where I’ve read or heard about our government doing little things to stir fear in the population. Mmmm?”

The government didn’t want to share this information for many years. They wanted it kept to law enforcement. It was not until the public demanded the information that the legislature acted to publicize the information. In fact, after the legislature acted initially, the public had to go into the Sheriff’s office and pay $5 for a copy of the registry in the zip code they wanted. No one was coming in. Finally, the State Police started putting it out on the Internet and the rest is history. So, I don’t think it is accurate to blame the government for fear mongering anymore than when Mica references “…the hysteria over the harm that registered sex offenders supposedly pose to children when the greatest majority (80-90% according to reliable sources) of new cases each year are committed by people NOT on a registry.”.

If you have children and are not “hysterical” about these types of crimes something is wrong with you. Even if you don’t have children you have nieces, nephews, sisters, brothers, etc. that can be victimized. Mica, I am not some luny-hysterical person…I am rightfully concerned about these offenders in our midst.

However, I do agree with Mica that we need to stay vigilant to the fact that many offenders are known to their victims. This means continued education of the public that perverts can be dentists, doctors, bankers, and even cops. They are not the proverbial dirty old man, unshaven, in a trench coat lurking in parks. They can be anyone. This education effort has to filter down to our children as well. The more we talk to them about potential sexual offenders and how to report concerns the safer all of our children, wifes, and loved ones will be. Registration is only one part of a containment approach-it is knowledge of who we are dealing with. We can pass that knowledge on to our loved ones….we can actually show them that sex offenders can look as normal as the next person. There will always be the unknown offenders that we have to guard against. However, can anyone really say that because we don’t know about the UNKNOWN offenders that we should temper what we know about the KNOWN offenders? That is not sound reasoning. I don’t care if the guy is a stat offender or not. It’s all the same when you get right down to it….you use the info. to protect your kids from people who cross boundaries. If you have a legit need to know more about an offender (to cut them a break for a job, etc.) either ask them and verify it against the police report, or speak to their probation officer.

Someone, I think Babs, asked where I got the information on the feds paying the states for listing additional names. I have seen two references to this - one in a posting from a criminal justice professional (in American Justice discussion forum), another in a news article from a Florida newspaper. I will have to research further - it was a provision in either the Jacob Wetterling act or the Dru Sjoden act. I think the particular act started with the name of an individual (Charles) and there was a last name attached, but it’s been awhile since I have seen the name. I will research.

I believe that the last comment (from anonymous) fit my way of thinking exactly. If parents and others want to know where all the risks to their children may be, we may as well open up to the public the entire criminal justice system and let everyone see everyone else’s record. Then we can judge who is safe to have as a neighbor or not. Why stop at sex offenders? That may, of course, cause a whole lot of divisiveness in our society, when people find out their records may be a matter for neighborhood gossip, but if we’re looking to be safe, why not?

Can anyone who does support public registries for sex offenders offer reasons why the criminal records of drunk drivers, thieves and embezzlers, and indeed any other criminal (past and current) not be placed in a giant registry and placed on the internet for all to see?

In response to #85 question, I think posting all of those records on the internet is putting the info at risk to computer hackers and such. The court computers and systems they use seem safer from outside hackers and are free to use if you take the time to request records and search for them at the courthouse.

Not that it wouldn’t be interesting, but until the internet is really secure, too much can happen to someone’s true record. If hackers can break into the FBI or Pentagon site, who’s to say they can’t turn your innocent Uncle Ted into a rapist or tone down a real child rapist’s record on the net?

id like to know if my neighbor has several theft and burglary convictions, or aggravated assault convictions, or DUI convictions.

The difference between checking on the records of sex offenders and others is that the former is on the internet and it’s free of charge. It is also extremely user friendly. In the latter cases, people must go down to the courthouse, look up the information and pay money.

Someone, I think “Guest” sounded distinctly sarcastic when he or she responded about putting all ex offenders’ records on the internet. It’s not a matter of this or that (sex offenders vs embezzlers) but sex offenders AND embezzlers. While I have never been a victim of a sex offender, I was the victim of a neighbor who broke into my house by kicking down the front door and grabbing about $5,000 worth of items. It would have been nice to know who my neighbors were so that I wouldn’t have made friends with him, only to be victimized by him. My boyfriend’s parents were killed by a repeat drunk driver. It would have been nice that this guy’s picture and address were put on the internet. It might have curbed his tendancy to drink and drive, and my boyfriend’s parents might still be alive today.

The basis for the community notification for sex offenders boils down to the recidivism rate of sex offenders. Most of the public believes they are sky high, which is a myth. What is not a myth is the recidivism rate of other criminals, such as thieves and drunk drivers.

If society is going to declare one class of criminal subject to public notification, put them all on the internet. (Maybe that’s why “guest” doesn’t want embezzlers’ records to go on the internet. Maybe he or she or someone he or she knows has a criminal record and would be subject to such a public notification?)

It is not just little girls. As I am sure you are aware, all of our kids are at risk.

Good post on the links.

The violent sexual offender status is placed on persons by the Idaho Sex Offender Classification Board. Check out this link to the site. It has a section on the designation process:

http://www2.state.id.us/socb/

Great point Tan. I myself had to do this first hand, it has been a long 2 years of fighting and they(the other parties attorney’s still try to cover or make up excuses) they try and say they aren’t to blame and yet in reality they are. My daughter was assaulted by a 18 yr old, of which the state and the county knew he was going to be a problem and they still put him out on the streets not letting anyone know. I believe everyone needs to know and I have gone to check areas around me now and for my nieces and nephews and friends kids. This is not something that anyone deserves to go through. This 18 year old is in prison now but he keeps getting parole hearing after parole hearing and noone seems to listen that he doesn’t deserve to be on the streets. Yes he is young, but he knew what he was doing was wrong. The victim I can tell you is blamed for this happening and seeing and living what I have been through for the last 2 years, I can see now why so much of it goes unreported. Cause the victim is blamed and not treated with any decency. Any comments you can email me I don’t have any problems. Paulas968@yahoo.com

Self confessed pedophile Jack McClellan is getting closer to Idaho. He is now in Portland, Oregon. Take a look at this interview Glenn Beck did with him. Totally amazing.

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bestoftv/2007/09/13/beck.mcclellan.interview.cnn

I am glad states provide online access to sex offender registries, but sometimes we see a listing, read the offense, and are still a little vague on what the case entailed. A 19 year old boy with a 16 year old girlfriend is less concerning to me than a 50 year old man violating a 3 year old girl, especially if he becomes my neighbor.

I looked at websites from other states. I love what Rhode Island does. On several offenders listings, they give extra details about the case. I hope one day Idaho will consider something like this. I have cut and pasted direct comments from various RI offenders for an example. They also classify them for the public to see on how likely they are to reoffend.
************
1st Degree Child Molestation. Assaulted a 13 year old female known to the offender at the time of the offense. Offender is subject to lifetime registration and lifetime community supervision based on his conviction.

3rd Degree Sexual Assault. Assaulted a 15 year old female not known to the offender at the time of the offense.

2nd Degree Sexual Assault. Assaulted a 25 year old female known to the offender at the time of the offense.

2nd Degree Sexual Assault. Offender assaulted an adolescent female known to the offender at the time of the offense.

1st Degree Sexual Assault. Offender assaulted an adult male known to the offender at the time of the offense.

1st Degree Child Molestation. Offender assaulted an 13 year old male known to the offender at the time of the offense.

Subject is a recidivist and has been convicted of 2nd Degree Sexual Assault

Subject was convicted of Second Degree Child Molestation. Victim was 4 year old females known to the offender
***************************

—-What do the rest of you think? It would be very helpful in my opinon.

I don’t know. I just lean more towards: a sexual predator is a sexual predator is a sexual predator. Anyway you slice it, they took advantage of somebody else, whether they knew the person or not.
That 19 year old STILL knew what he or she was doing was wrong and against the law in our country. Which is why they probably don’t list all that detailed information to begin with.

There you go, an even better situation. You will find out much more from the police station records than from a 1-line summary.

When I discovered a close neighbor was registered sex offender, the charge was rape. Upon examining his record, he was 28 and got his 16 yo girlfriend pregnant. Still not great, but a hair better than a full child molester.

Yeah, going down to check the records yourself would be the best. I also found this neighbor has been sued several times for not paying bills, so I wish the landlord luck when they finish up that rental.

Interesting story from Channel 6 on sexual offender notification. Some Idaho residents want better notification by law enforcement that certain offenders are moving into their area.

http://www.kpvi.com/global/story.asp?s=7165588

Idaho only publishes Violent Sexual Predator photos and leaves it at that. Oregon uses a system of in person notification for high to medium risk offenders by sending personnel out to residents that live in close proximity to offenders…I belive it is 2 blocks notice for violent predators and one block for medium risk offenders. Should Idaho mimick Oregon’s notification methods?

I firmly believe in keeping our kids safe from threats, but while we are focusing on one threat, let us also remember the others. This is from an essay that I found re this topic.

U.S. Department of Justice, National Incidence Studies of Missing, Abducted, Runaway, and Throwaway Children.
http://www.missingkids.com/en_US/documents/nismart2_overview.pdf
- First, notice the title of the USDOJ’s report. “Throwaway”, such a word exists when talking about children.
- Page 5 of the report shows the estimated number of missing children at 1,315,600 that year. Of those, only 797,500 were reported. That means that 518,600 children went missing that year and their parents didn’t even bother to report it!
- Page 6 identifies 628,900 kids as “runaway/thrownaway”. Over a half a millions who were either thrown away or faced home lives so horrific that they ran away.
- Page 7 of the report says this about stereotypical kidnappings…”Such abductions are rare enough that the estimates…are not very reliable”. It also says, “Stereotypical kidnappings are the particular type of nonfamilial abduction that receives the most media attention and involves a stranger or slight acquaintance…holds the child for ransom, abducts the child, or kills the child.” And regarding these stereotypical kidnappings everybody’s afraid of, the report said this…”They represent an extremely small portion of all missing children. (The Law Enforcement Study found that an estimated 115 of the nonfamilial abductions were victims of stereotypical kidnappings and 90 of these qualified as reported missing.)” Out of 1,315,600 missing kids 115 were snatched in the sense that everybody is worried about. And that includes kids that were snatched for ransom, and kids that were snatched by a disturbed or distraught person who wanted a child of their own, so how many are left that were snatched by the sex offender that everybody thinks is hiding behind the tree? Feel free to calculate the percentage (go ahead and use the full 115 if it makes you feel better) of kids who were snatched in a stereotypical kidnapping compared against that 1.3 Million who went missing that year.
- So, it looks like less than 1/100th of 1% were snatched. But the money, the attention, the energy, the urgency all goes towards protecting that 1/100th of 1%. Of course, even then we’re not actually protecting that fraction either. Yet, I hear the cries of “protect the children!” in the air. Let me know when you’d like to start.
- In the meantime, we’re ignoring the other 99.99% That’s not just a statistic or a number. It’s 1,315,485 real kids. Of course, that was in 2002. I think it’s safe to assume the problem hasn’t gone away since then.
- Page 11 of the report states that “…40 missing children who were stereotypically kidnapped and killed (an estimated 35) or were still missing (approximately 5) at the time of the study.” Yes, that is too many. But are we going to ignore all the others to concentrate on less than 1/200th of 1%?

- Center for Disease Control
http://webapp.cdc.gov/sasweb/ncipc/leadcaus10.html
A quick look at Top Ten deaths in minors in 2002 shows that there were 17,759 kids who died in 2002 (excluding infant mortality).
Of those:
296 were shot to death by someone,
45 were stabbed to death,
89 were strangled,
37 were burned alive,
17 were poisoned,
603 shot themselves,
559 hung themselves, and
6132 were killed in traffic accidents.
This tells us that in 2002:
Your child was 1400% more likely to hang themselves than be snatched and killed by a sex offender.
Your child was 1500% more likely to shoot themselves than be snatched and killed by a sex offender
Your child was 3200% more likely to be murdered by firearm by someone besides a sex offender.
Your child was 4000% more likely to be shot, stabbed, strangled, burned alive or poisoned than snatched and killed by a sex offender.
Your child was 15300% more likely to be killed in a car crash than snatched and killed by a sex offender.

Jeralee was kidnapped in the middle of the day.

oh, also, she wasn’t abducted at the house; her abductor saw her collecting at a friend’s house; left the friend’s house, got his car and waited for her to walk by on the sidewalk; grabbed her and tossed her into the car in front of a witness…can’t place blame on the newspaper for that….

Referring to Paula’s message (#28):
It is unfortunate that the girl was assaulted but you stated it yourself, the probation officer royally messed-up. There should have been no way for the offender to be placed in the house where anyone under 18 lived. That was apparently a probation requirement. The probation officer failed in that aspect badly.
You also stated that the young man had very little supervision. I am not sure if this meant from his probation officer or the mother. If the probation officer was not doing his or her job and not keeping this young man accountable, then they ought to be held criminally liable.
If you were referring to the mother, whether she knew about his past or not, she had to have been made aware that the young man was being placed there for a reason. Extra precautions should have been taken and questions asked before he ever took a single step in the home. Too many failures prompted a tragic result. Let us not hold only the offender accountable but also those who failed to be responsible and uphold a duty to protect. others.

What a sick man and terrible story. Right out of our own Jefferson County.

http://www.localnews8.com/Global/story.asp?S=7362361

Let’s hope Judge Moss puts him away for a long time. I just can’t see rehabilitation possible for this heinous of a crime, which lasted 20 YEARS! I look at my 2 year old girl and what he did to all of the victims sickens and upsets me.

Sex Offenders are required to obtain a psychosocial evaluation for use by the Court in sentencing. If Neff did not obtain an evaluation Moss may have sent him to Cottonwood to supposedly get one. However, the prison system does not provide comprehensive evaluations. They are not funded for such activity anyway. What they do at Cottonwood is set up a plan of classes that in this case are not sexual offender specific. Neff will go through the same set up classes that Kimball Mason went through.

The stat of 89% of offenders receiving probation is correct–most offenders can and will follow the rules–especially sexual offenders. They are good at compliance on the surface which is all the rider measures.

Judge Moss is a weak judge. This is the same judge that gave Ronald Hamburg a rider in Madison County. Hamburg kidnapped and molested a little 5 year old girl at a park in Rexburg. He did the rider received probation did his 5 year probation sentence and is now off supervision living in our community. Judge Moss is also the same judge that sentenced Richard Duff to a rider and then probation. Duff was a counselor at the Juvenile Corrections Center in St. Anthony. He abused females that had gone through the program. Duff was caught violating probation 3 times for major violations and Moss wouldn’t send him until finally porn was found on a computer Duff was accessing. In fact, Moss hates to send anyone to prison. He states that every time in Court. Moss needs to stop coddling these criminals. Unfortunately, he has been on the bench too long and needs to be removed from office.

This case makes me sick and we need to get this judge off the bench! He’s a disgrace to our community and this state and unless people start writing our elected officials to let them know what we think, he will continue to stay in office and give these child molesters slaps on the wrist and probation. It sickens me to no end to see all the cases this judge has presided over and given the offenders light sentences and/or probation.
This judge needs to go and he needs to go NOW!

The State Police have updated their SO registration website. It now has a map generator (requires Javascript). It is worth checking out:

http://www.isp.state.id.us/sor_id/map_search.htm

I’m sure the victim’s family or supporters would come out in the dozens if they knew about it somehow. When these guys he lets off easy go back to the communities and one of our little girls or boys is the next one hurt, there’s going to be a real uproar.

My wonder is: Would a jury of our peers convict one of us parents who attacks or harms a man who molests our child? Especially if he had done it before and barely received a slap? If I was on a jury, would my sympathy for the parent override my duties as a jury member to uphold the law? No right or wrong answer here, I’m pondering is all.

Why was Judge Gregory Anderson disqualified? I keep waiting for something to come out about this story that might give us some insight as to the sentence that Nef got. However, everything I read seems to point in the opposite direction. The victims and their families must be going through Hell right now. I would rather imagine that Nef’s family is having a tough time also; but this man needs to be locked up in general population with a sign on him telling what he did.

Mike, I understand what you mean when you ask how this attorney can sleep at night. However, it is his job to defend his client and someone has to do it. Unfortunately, given a good attorney and a passive judge, the perv is off the hook.

Me, it’s very unfortunate but mom/dad go to jail. That simple.

Once a mom always a mom and I would certainly want to kill someone who hurt my child even as adult children. I also recognize it would only hurt my kids worse.

Sometimes children don’t tell the parents about abuse due to exactly that concern. Dad states, “If anyone laid a hand on my daughter, I’d kill them”. He may or may not mean it. But take an impressionable 10 year old for example. The thought of daddy going to prison is going to be enough to clam her right up. So while I understand (more than I’ll say) where you all are coming from. Be careful that your kids aren’t listening. And keep your anger in check, for their sake.

An assistant librarian in Lindsay, California, was fired because she called police when she found a man viewing child porn on a computer in the library.

According to a report on OneNewsNow.com, Brenda Biesterfeld discovered the man viewing images of naked boys who appeared to be 9 to 13 years old. She reported the incident to her supervisor, Judi Hill, who told Biesterfeld to pass the man a note that said he would be banned if he did it again. Biesterfeld was also told to make note of it in the man’s library record. Biesterfeld asked Hill “[A]nd after I do that, Judi, then I need to contact the police, right?” And the answer was no.

Biesterfeld asked again to make sure she heard right, and Hill told her it was more common than she thought. After thinking it over at home Biesterfeld decided to call the police and report it. The police told her to call them if and when it happened again, and she did. The man came back to the library and was arrested while viewing child porn. Upon further investigation, more child porn was found at the man’s house as well. After this service to the public, Biesterfeld was told that she had no loyalty to the county and was fired from the library.

Yeah, that story is disturbing. Rarely does the news report both sides of the story (sometimes because they really don’t know it) but that just seems wrong, as reported.

The problem with the filters is that they can’t keep up. There are an average of 3,000 new porn sites set up every day, according to the US Dept. of Justice!

If a public entity uses a subscription service to filter the “filth” it takes some time for the subscription service to do it’s job. That is unfortunately the limit of technology.

If I were on the city council of this town I would raise cain and get that woman her job back. Absolutely ridiculous for them to fire her for reporting a crime. I suppose if she had seen a crime in the library she is supposed to be tight lipped too? Most states have laws that require child abuse to be reported. If child porn isn’t child abuse I don’t know what is!!!

“Chiasm said Good idea but you only get part of the picture from this. What many don’t realize is that a lot of the times the molestors are able to get plea bargains to avoid the sex offender registry - and thats not always the fault of the police / prosecutor. The guy who lives across the street from me molested his step daughter and was arrested for it. In the meantime the stepdaughter went to live across country with her real father who wouldn’t bring her back for a trial. So the molestor got the charges reduced from a felony lewd and lacivious charge to a misdemeanor battery charge- no different than if he had punched someone. He is a child molestor and he shows up on no lists. There are many more just like him.”

I know of something that happened extremely similiar to this except that my friend gave an impact statement and everything. Its called Penal Code 1385 “interest of justice”. The victim is not notified and the molester got a “lesser” charge of “willfully trying to cause a child death under 14″ instead of the “lewd act”. In other words because this was his first offense (first time he got caught!) he was able to plea bargain…how can this be overturned and why don’t they have to notify the victim of this change?

Didn’t work for me, either.

wow. It timed out on me the first time, then said the web page could not be found. I just tried it again and it went right there. Maybe because it’s 5:30am? I have no idea.

The state’s database has problems also, unfortunately.

For example, there is the sex offender I think his name is George Jones, he was busted peeking under girl’s room stalls at the Bonneville County Fairgrounds several months ago. He used to live near Freeman Park on Elmore, but you only saw that by searching for his name. Searching by map only did not show a pinpoint on his address. I see he’s moved now to Holbrooke and he display both ways, but it made me wonder why he failed to show up before and how many others may not be displayed properly.

I just tried the state site, it worked fine, except in the area I searched it looks like most registrants were barely 18 when convicted for LEWD COND W/MINOR CHLD U/16. As a victim of molestation myself I have to say, offensive though some may find it, that there is a tremendous difference between rape/child molestation and consensual sex between say a 15 and 17/18 y.o., and categorizing them together trivializes the most grievous crimes, who knows what long term impact it has on some of these young men whose pictures are publicly posted.

If that ever happened to MY daughter, I’d be exacting frontier justice on that lowlife by removing his nether regions via a brand new surgical scalpel. That would certainly ensure any recidivism from that individual.
Of course this is just my “thoughts & opinion” on the matter as we’re just talking here. But still.

CR67, in comment 101 are you referring to a particular case? Unless I am missing something, which is certainly possible, having come to the conversation late, I wonder how a 19 year old necessarily knows the age of someone he has consensual sex with. People do sometimes lie, to others as well as themselves. Are you arguing that consensual sex between two teenagers qualifies as rape as if there was force?

It can’t exactly be considered “consensual” if “force” was involved now could it?
Of course I don’t think it’s considered rape if two consensual teens have sex, but all too often 18 & 19 y/o boys are charged with rape for having consensual sex with a 15 or 16 y/o girl.

I agree…that’s definately a tough one. I think 16 should be the minimum ag, as it is in most states. In reality, most girls under the age of 16 (let alone some 16-18 y/o’s) just aren’t mature enough to make that type of decision. IMO
So males should be aware of this when dating a girl under 16. I also don’t think jail time is appropriate punishment in these cases, let alone being labeled for the rest of your life as a “sexual predator”. On the same token, I don’t think a young man over the age of 19 should be dating a girl who’s 15 or 16 to begin with…..let alone those guys that are 21 and over. Thats when I think guys are really taking advantage of a younger girl. But again….thats just my opinion.

Offenders aren’t labeled for life, necessarily. Idaho Code provides that upon completion of probation, the offender can petition the District Court after 10 years and if they show compelling evidence of rehabilitation, no reoffense(s)-including other crimes, holding a job, maybe even having a family, etc….they can be removed from the sexual offender registry requirement.

Why should society be so concerned about these folks being labeled as sexual offenders? Shouldn’t these young people be the ones who are concerned? Perhaps their parents should be more concerned too? Or should society just get rid of this law because people are being labeled for the rest of their life? Perhaps we should get rid of alot of other laws too….I mean, society shouldn’t be in the business of labeling people….people then have to take responsibility for their actions and misguided attempts at instant self gratification. That is a terrible standard to impose. People should just be able to do whatever they want with no consequences.

Ah, after so many fair and balanced comments, Mike has left the building and has entered Snarky Sarcastic Comment Land (where I am residing as I speak).

Mike, do you have (or have you raised) teenagers? I’ve raised two girls and have a stepdaughter turning 15 next month. I also have two stepsons.

My first two girls, hey, they were mature enough to prefer 18 year old boys when they themselves were only 14. They both grew up and married men their own ages.

My stepdaughter is turning 15 next month. She isn’t even looking at boys yet. And my two stepsons, one is almost 18 and one is almost 21, are such immature lads that pretty much, girls their own age will have nothing to do with them. (But younger girls think they’re pretty cool). (And no, neither of the boys are in trouble in any way, so I’m not speaking from some personal agenda.)

So I think that this issue is difficult to resolve, because as a society we place the blame on the boy, when the boy may not be the more mature person in the relationship even if he is older. Thus the inequity, when we see that this law creates predator labels on some who are not predators.

But I agree with Abby and CR67, I don’t know where to draw the line to say when it’s okay and when it’s not.

Yeah, Abby, that kind of thing happened with my oldest daughter. She went missing on her 14th birthday. We finally found her later that day in an apartment with two 18 year old sailors she had met recently (that was back when the Navy was in town, years ago). She was blithely doing their laundry and playing video games and having a great time.

They damn near died when we told them her real age, because she was so smart and mature (and later graduated HS a month after her 17th birthday) and they were green at the gills when they realized how close they might have come to prison terms.

I don’t think hormones are more a male issue than female, both get ‘em bad during adolescence.

Also consider the way society looks at the age gaps later…folks think nothing of the 50 yr old guy with a 30 yr old girlfriend…But unless it’s Demi Moore/Ashton Kutcher, they generally look askance when the woman is older.

The Bonneville County Prosecutor’s Office has been using an unwritten rule, at least since Dane Watkins, that they use a 5 year age difference as a filter to decide whether to prosecute statutory offenders or not (unless the parents really raise a stink and/or some other significant intangibles are present).

Basically, Prosecutor Bruce Pickett won’t charge unless there is a 5 year age difference between the parties. So for example, a 16 year old hooking up with an 18 year old never gets charged in this jurisdiction….unless it isn’t consentual or the person is a repeat offender, etc. This criteria screeens out alot of cases.
So, by the time they do charge somebody around here they have obviously earned the attention of the Court.

I think 5 years is probably a good sound “reasonable and prudent person” concept in this area. At least it’s a start…any more than that and there’s some reason to dig a little deeper, imo.

Maybe Judge Moss likes child porn.

Is anyone going to take back all the criticism of Judge Moss now? You may recall as it was mentioned in this thread he sentenced pedophile Michael Nef to a six month rider at Cottonwood while he Nef underwent an evaluation. There was a lot of angst on this forum as many falsely assumed this was all Nef was going to get. Local news is now announcing that Nef has completed his evaluation and based on that Moss has sentenced Nef to serve a minimum of 25 years in prison which at Nef’s age is basically life in prison.

Didn’t Nef get 5 years minimum?

Nef is eligible for parole in 2012!!! That’s hardly a life sentence. Once again…a slap on the wrist for child predators in this state!

Should sex offenders be eligible for reduced sentences/probation? That is stupid.

ALL public libraries, public schools, etc. If you know of a library in California where this isn’t the case, perhaps you should notify them that their network is open to receiving pornographic images.
What I wanna know is why would somebody go to a library to look at porn? That’s pretty idiotic…..but that’s just my opinion.

Perhaps you should check your facts. I’m sure if you contact the library in question, they’ll tell you they have some sort of filter in place to prevent obscene material from being accessed, and if they didn’t at the time of the offense, I’m sure they do now.
But what do I care? I’m not the one checking out porn in a public library.

I’m a network administrator at ISU and we have filters on our pc’s to prevent the access to porn and inappropriate material. The majority of major corporations in America do as well. Just because some don’t doesn’t mean they all do. I’ve known a number of libraries across the country that do, as well as most schools and colleges. Why somebody would support the viewing of porn on a public network where children may be around is hard for me to understand, but hey to each his own. I say if you’re so interested in viewing that type of material, do it in the privacy of your own home.

Crystal, if you want people to listen to your opinion, it would probably be helpful for you to refrain from calling someone else’s opinion “ignorant and erroneous”.

You may get more people to listen to your opinion rather than having them be immediately put off by your “attack mode.”

Just a thought.

Anonymous, I understand what you are saying, but I have not expressed my opinion, beyond the opinion that debating with people who don’t know the difference between an opinion and a fact, and present their opinions as facts, is a total waste of time.

And thanks, CR67, for clearing up that your statements regarding internet filtering in public libraries were “beliefs.” I had misunderstood that you were speaking factually on this topic.

ig·no·rant (gnr-nt)
adj.
1. Lacking education or knowledge.
2. Showing or arising from a lack of education or knowledge: an ignorant mistake.
3. Unaware or uninformed.

——————————————————————————–

[Middle English ignoraunt, from Old French ignorant, from Latin ignrns, ignrant-, present participle of ignrre, to be ignorant, not to know; see gn- in Indo-European roots.]

o·pin·ion (-pnyn)
n.
1. A belief or conclusion held with confidence but not substantiated by positive knowledge or proof: “The world is not run by thought, nor by imagination, but by opinion” Elizabeth Drew.
2. A judgment based on special knowledge and given by an expert: a medical opinion.
3. A judgment or estimation of the merit of a person or thing: has a low opinion of braggarts.
4. The prevailing view: public opinion.
5. Law A formal statement by a court or other adjudicative body of the legal reasons and principles for the conclusions of the court.

Babs, you obviously were not reading carefully in the first place. Glad it works for you.

CR67,

Then what else are we?

The word animal has as it’s root the Latin, Anima,

anima-, anim- (Latin: animal life; breath; soul; mind).
Anima- is “a living being” from a Latin form meaning, “of air, having a spirit, living”, which in turn comes from another form meaning, “breath of air, air, soul, life”.

From Merriam-Webster:

Main Entry: 1an·i·mal
Pronunciation: \?a-n?-m?l\
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin, from animale, neuter of animalis animate, from anima soul — more at animate
Date: 14th century
1: any of a kingdom (Animalia) of living things including many-celled organisms and often many of the single-celled ones (as protozoans) that typically differ from plants in having cells without cellulose walls, in lacking chlorophyll and the capacity for photosynthesis, in requiring more complex food materials (as proteins), in being organized to a greater degree of complexity, and in having the capacity for spontaneous movement and rapid motor responses to stimulation
2 a: one of the lower animals as distinguished from human beings b: mammal; broadly : vertebrate
3: a human being considered chiefly as physical or nonrational; also : this nature
4: a person with a particular interest or aptitude
5: matter, thing ; also : creature 1c
— an·i·mal·like \-m?(l)-?l?k\ adjective

oops wrong thread

Right back atya Babs

If you ignore it…..it will ffffaaaaadddddeeeeeeeee away…………………..

Don’t give it any energy and talk about something else. That is one of the best defenses to comments that annoy or harrass.

Death penalty. One strike, you’re out. Rehabilitation my bleep.

I apologize for inadvertently violating rule 3 in post 199.

Not supporting murder by the state is certainly reasonable.

I interpret child molestation as a kind of murder, and think that allowing child molesters to reoffend by granting them any degree of freedom is to allow “murder” by the state.

I’d be willing to compromise and let them be housed for life, but for the inhumanity in that, and the fact that we all gotta go sometime and aren’t exactly facing a people shortage. But in our less than perfect world I agree with Nemesis that we can’t let the state kill.

So instead, we (as taxpayers) should foot the bill to keep these people alive with room board and 3 squares a day? (not in MY book!)
But I respect your opinion on the matter.

My comment #204 makes no sense. I was trying to be delicate.

Suffice it to say, I wanted to kill/maim/destroy my perpetrators…and luckily for me other, more detached people kept me from making that tragedy into a worse mistake that I couldn’t recover from.

Great suggestion Crystal! (note the sarcasm in my voice)

Our company once decided to see what the usual punishment was for child rapers and molesters. We started at the “As” and worked through 63 names in that category. If you want to see the results, hit (my name) It will shock you. The majority of the cases we pulled got 120-160 days and then probation.

Why are we letting out people who have ruined the lives of children? Rape ONE child, go to jail for life. Period. The reason why we punish murderers is because we value life. It doesn’t matter if you kill “just one” person. That life mattered. So you lose your life or your freedom.

Don’t kids matter? The way we punish those who beat, rape or torture kids, it sure doesn’t seem that way! So much for the value assigned to our kids.

This isn’t about forgiveness. This is about making the punishment fit the crime because we respect and honor the victim.

And also we should punish severely so that others will see this and fear. That’s the second part of this discussion: stopping crime.FEAR stops crime. Take a child molester, surround him or her with hundreds of naked kids and put two big guards with stun batons on either side of the person. Tell the molester that if he or she even touches a child that they will apply the baton to their genitals and see whether FEAR of being hurt won’t deter their actions.

Since we can’t hire guards to follow these people day and night with genital zappers, keep them in jail.

not to mention she’s mentioned “her business” on two other posts besides this one. We welcome her comments as a new user, but don’t feel it’s appropriate to obtain free advertizing on this site. But of course that’s completely up to you.

None

What Marie said!

Your kids are much more likely to be molested by Uncle Johnny, best friend Charlie, grandpa, dad, or older brother than they are by anyone on the sex offender list. The vast vast vast majority of molested kids are victimized by a close relative or trusted family friend.

Because rape hits the news on every occasion? I wouldn’t call the paper a reliable source for Idaho’s rape cases.

In my opinion, if you’re a 20 y/o man attempting to sleep with a 15 y/o girl, you’re a scumbag & you deserve a rape charge/record! I don’t care how “mature” that 15 y/o girl thinks she is, she’s not mature enough to consent to sleeping around with a 20 y/o man.
But that’s just me.

Your missing the point though.

Rape and L&L carry the same punishment. But the prosecutor is much more likely to get a conviction on the L&L charge. So doesn’t it make complete sense to go with the charge you can convict on rather than the one you might lose and have the guy go free on? Is it that important to you that the charge reads “rape” that your willing to risk having some of them go free? Again, the punishments are the same, the requirement to register is the same, its all the same except the name of the charge. Especially if you’ve got an unwilling victim in the 15 year old who is going to refuse to testify.

I think perhaps I didn’t make my point clear enough (my apologies…it was late at night). What I meant by what I know from reading the paper is how many rape cases are dropped all together, for various reasons. I somehow doubt that all the cases dropped were just a matter of a woman (or guy in a few cases) falsely claiming they were raped…

As such, the discrepency that I found between the registry is that nearly all of the cases that *are* convicted involve persons under the age of 16…persons of legal age in this city have a difficult time, it would appear, getting a rape charge to stick against their offender, assuming they bring it up to authorities at all.

It was that little factoid I found interesting.

So in those cases, the prosecutor can’t go for L&L because the person is an adult, not under 16.

I personally don’t care about the label attached to it for those under the age of “consent” - whatever a person can more easily be convicted of, as long as its warranted, is fine by me.

The discussion of “consensual” sex by a minor is an interesting topic, however, and I think the registry would do well to have what the various convictions actually mean easily accessible (I found them, but it took some digging). For example, I doubt most people knew about what Anonymous wrote, and I doubt most people know the difference between a Statutory Rape conviction and an L&L conviction, or any number of other convictions with little differences.

Sad topic, on the whole.

Let me tell you guys a story…

Guy RAPES a 16 year old. He’s in his late twenties. She did NOT consent in any way, shape or form. He is let out on pretrial. While he is out on pretrial he tries to RAPE another girl-19 this time. She had been harassed by him with threatening text messages, etc and told that if she said anything he would hurt her mother. The day she was almost raped, her own cousin set her up with an urgent message for her to come over to her house right away. When she got there the scum bag was waiting, picked her up, took her upstairs and tried to rape her. She fought and got away.

Then she found out that he had tried the same MO of texting messages etc to her other cousin-15. The gruesome-twosome was setting her up for the come-over-to-the-house set up for her too. Once she found out from the 19 year old what was happening, she didn’t go.

Okay, her Dad calls me and says he wants to “take care of this” himself. I say no, let’s go to the cops. We do. They take a report and promise a follow up with a detective which does not happen. We all go to see the PA in charge of sex crimes. He promises to “take action” because he is “very hard on sex crimes.” He also promises a detective visit. Nothing happens. This was also reported to the IF police chief. NO FOLLOW UP WITH THE VICTIMS BY A DETECTIVE!

Another phone call and visit. More promises. Nothing. The guy is STILL OUT ON PRETRIAL.

The day comes for him to be sentenced after he pleads guilty to the L and L charge for the 16 year old.. We show up each time it comes up. Postponement twice. Third time he is up for L and L. No mention of what he tried to do to the 19 year old and the harassment of the 15 year old. The defense lawyer asks for probation as this is “his first offense.” Guess what? That PA who is so hard on sex crimes ASKS FOR THE SAME DAMN THING! This RAPIST is supposed to get out with probation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But then the judge says that the cop who busted him for the 16 year old thinks he is “less than truthful” about the events that happened during his pretrial period. He mentions some disturbing things in his file, (like the letter from the father and the victims, I’ll bet!) and he says, “Sorry Bubba, I don’t think it would serve the community for